I knew I said that I wasn’t going to post until after the new year, but my Mama told me to go and read Jerry Crasnick’s interview with Baggy, who didn’t exactly speak in any sort of cliches. I’m proud of the guy – he’s talked more openly about his opinions about steroids and weightlifting and roiding baseball players than any other real Hall of Fame candidate who is busy either decrying the McGwires of the world as EVIL or puffing himself up with innocence (Saint Dale Murphy). I think it took some serious, uh, guts (ahem) to dare to say what he says about players and performance enhancers.
My favorite excerpt?
“People can say anything they want about Barry Bonds and Mark McGwire, but it was fun to watch. Barry Bonds is the best player I’ve ever seen. He would stand on first base and say, ‘If they throw that pitch again, I’m taking them deep.’ Then guess what? The next at-bat, he would take them deep. He could steal a base anytime he wanted to steal a base, and he was always safe. I’ve only seen three or four people who could ever do that. No matter what anybody says about Barry or Mark, who I love to death, they were great players and they were fun to watch.”
And you KNOW that LOTS of people will use that statement as proof positive that Bagwell used roids and is too cowardly to admit it and then do the right thing and commit suicide, or something, because of the enormity of the depravity of this heinous crime of using (shudder) some chemical to either heal injuries, get better, or continue playing.
Check out the rest of the interview.
I know there are the Jeff Pearlmans of the world who absolutely INSIST that Bagwell is positively guilty of using steroids because he lifted weights, played first base and hit home runs (and as we all know, no male is capable of adding any muscle weight merely by lifting weights) and because he wasn’t an outspoken critic of roids who demanded that testing be implemented (like his “twin” Frank Thomas) or declared innocent for some unknown reason, like Jim Thome. Fortunately, Pearlman doesn’t have a HOF vote.
(UPDATE 45 minutes later): I swear to GOD that I wrote what I wrote about Pearlman BEFORE I read what he said about Bagwell on his blog. And dammed if he didn’t say almost word for word exactly what I thought he’d say. If you hit home runs, if you did not look when you finished your career exactly as skinny as you looked when you were 21, if, in fact, you lifted weights, if you did not loudly demand steroid testing – and best I know, Frank Thomas was the only active player who did – then you MUST be presumed guilty of steroid use. I wonder if Pearlman knows that not all steroid users put on muscle weight that is obvious – see Manny Alexander/Alex Sanchez. I wonder if Pearlman is going to just come out with a blanket condemnation of every single player during 93-05 who didn’t loudly demand steroid testing – and if so, why not. And I also wonder when he is going to start accusing Carlton Fisk and Mickey Tettleton of being steroid users seeing as how they claim that they only put on all that muscle weight later in their careers from lifting weights. And I sure nuff would like to know who all these known steroid users on the Astros were from 95 to 04 (remembering that Caminiti was gone in 95 and was no longer friends with Bagwell/Biggio due to his alcoholism)…
I know that some HOF voters are refusing to vote for ANY player who played during the steroid ERA and will only consider candidates whose career ended before 1993/1994 because they have decided that since they can’t positively KNOW for absolute certain who did and did not use, they are all being presumed guilty.
And here’s what Joe Posnanski, the best baseball writer on the planet (sorry Richard, but not all ballplayers can be Babe Ruth) has to say about Bagwell in his most recent piece:
“…It looks like Bagwell will fall well short. And I can only come up with two somewhat related reasons:
1. The crazy offensive Selig Era has made us jaded about spectacular offensive numbers. That’s understandable, I guess. Bagwell’s six seasons of 39-plus home runs would have seemed otherworldly twenty years ago. After all, that’s as many as Willie Mays had, more than Mickey Mantle had, as many as Reggie Jackson and Mike Schmidt COMBINED. But the Selig Era has taken the jolt out of those numbers, in part because of steroids but also in part because we simply have grown numb after seeing home run after home run after home run after home run.
2. Jeff Bagwell — though he never tested positive for steroids, never was implicated in any public way, was not named in the Mitchell Report or by anyone on the record as a suspected user, and is not even on this rather comprehensive list of players linked to steroids or HGH — seems to have become in some voter’s minds a player who used performance enhancing drugs.
I can’t even begin to describe my disgust at No. 2 … it makes me absolutely sick to my stomach….
Check out the rest of his article. Pos is so good that I even read his non-baseball blog entries just for the pleasure of reading his writing.
Tags: Houston Astros, MLB
I hate that Bagwell’s name was thrown around like a dirty sock, in the steroids
era. I would LOVE to meet the very FIRST person, to mouth-off about Jeff.
As long as there are malicious people, running their mouths…..there will be
others to spread the news. It sick, and not true………but there will be folks
who WILL think Bagwell’s name was “in there”. Happy New Year, girlfriend!:)
happy New Year to you too becky!!!!
thing about bagwell is that the supposed “proof” is that he lifted weights and put on muscle. and that he improved from hitting a couple home runs as a scrawny AA 3B to hitting more home runs as a scrawny 1B in the Dome. oh yeah – and that he was teammates with caminiti 2 years before he started shooting up and he was also teammates with luis gonzalez and steve finley years before they started hitting well. oh yeah. and roger clemens AFTER testing had already started
i can understand people who say that between 91 and 03 you have NO idea how many baseball players used and everyone must be under suspicion. OK, fine. but, like baggy said, to insist that there were NO great baseball players during that time is absurd – or that they can’t be compared to one another.
no steroid made any baseball player i know of, great. unless, of course, we are all gonna insist that without exception, every hall of fame ballplayer who played between 91 and 04 MUST have been using roids – including randy johnson, who got better after age 30, including pedro martinez, who is obviously too small and skinny to throw hard, including tom glavine and greg maddux, union men, who lasted 20 years each without any injuries, including junior griffey, who suddenly and mysteriously completely broke down with endless injuries at age 30 (a sure sign of roid use), including curt schilling, who smartly made plenty of pre-emptive strikes by wagging his fingers all over the place about steroids and steroid users
etcetcetc
The stupid steroids talk I expected. That Jack Morris has more votes than Bagwell sums up the perception vs. reality problem. I can’t think of another 30-30 first basemen or a player on the ballot with as well rounded a game. Larkin, Alomar and Bagwell are first ballot HOFers.
billy,
there is a LOT of prejudice in this world. there is exactly zero evidence for concluding that bagwell used steroids and (say) derek jeter did not. but people have these feelings they can’t really justify and so they use lame ass excuses like – well, bagwell is guilty because if he didn’t use, why didn’t he call a press conference and denounce other ballplayers by name or demand an investigation or some such shtt – but it is fine that cal ripken/tony gwynn/derek jeter/jim thome didn’t because they are too “noble” to have even known that anyone would do such a thing. or – well i don’t believe that any man would lift weights unless he was also using steroids, unless he was carlton fisk or mickey tettleton.
i do NOT get the jack morris support. he just wasn’t that good a pitcher – no awards, not one ERA/strikeout/WINS title for ANY year. and he had exactly ONE of many great post season games. the “pitching to the score” silliness has been thoroughly debunked – the guy compiled wins because he played on a lot of winning teams. not a lot of bad teams.
agree about larkin and alomar, too – it is ridiculous that they were ignored in favor of jim ed rice.
shrug
what can i say.
i am, however, proud of bagwell for having the guts to say that barry lamar bonds is the best player he ever saw (for the record, lance berkman has said the same thing)
Hi Lisa,
Sorry to be late to the coffee klatsch, but have been pretty much under the table ever since the ball dropped. (can I say that?)
It sure is great to have some interesting baseball news finally, now in the dead of winter, event though it comes in the aftermath of Bags’ jilting from the HOF voters.
I read the Pearlman blog piece and was impressed by the cleverness, wisdom and depth of the arguments—from the commenters, telling him how poorly he had made his case.
Also, I had not been keeping track of active players who “outspokenly” called for testing, but I do recall that our very own Puma wanted “immediate blood testing,” perhaps not quite as vociferously as Jeff’s 5/29/67 twin Frank.
I’m hoping for a great new year and new decade with you and all of our virtual friends who care about the Astros, old and new.
hi becky!!!
baggy had better get elected BEFORE 2013 because that is when maddux/glavine/bonds/clemens etc are gonna hit the ballots
wags,
pearlman wrote 4 more blog entries and a SI piece justifying his hatred of roiders, but still finding himself unable to provide any decent explanation why, if he hates players from “the steroid era” that he could support players like alomar and larkin when he has absolutely no more proof that they shot up than he does bagwell – AND they didn’t demand steroid testing at union meetings any more than baggy.
i really don’t understand why pearlman stays in a prefession filled with people he despises.
shrug
and i hope for a great new year for you too – and also for all our few remaining astros fans